Bonni: [00:00:01] In today’s episode Doug McKee joins me to talk about his online course that is taught in such a way as to be about as close to an in person class as you can get but without being bound by geographic barriers.

Production Credit: [00:00:15] Produced by Innovate Learning. Maximizing human potential.

Bonni: [00:00:24] Welcome to this episode of Teaching in Higher Ed. This is the space where we explore the art and science of being more effective at the militating learning. We also share ways to increase our personal productivity approaches, so we can have more peace in our lives and be even more present for our students.

Bonni: [00:00:52] Today I welcome back to the show Doug McKee. He is the Associate Chair and Senior Lecturer of Economics at Yale. His additional fields of interest are development economics, labor economics, health economics, and structural estimation.

Bonni: [00:01:11] Doug welcome back to Teaching in Higher Ed.

Doug: [00:01:13] It’s great to be here again Bonni.

Bonni: [00:01:16] As I continue to learn, or I shouldn’t say learn about you but tell others about you I go to your Twitter bio. It says you’re a lecturer in the Yale Economics department and I love this last half.

Bonni: [00:01:27] It says: I believe all great teachers have a lot to learn and that certainly reflects who you are and the work that you do. But I’m curious now that we know a little bit about your academic endeavors there at Yale and we know you have this passion for continual improvement in your teaching. What do we not know about you that’s important to know about who you are?

Doug: [00:01:49] Well there’s the fact that it took me quite a long time to figure out that I’m a teacher. My undergraduate degree in Computer Science and I have a passion for reading but I really wanted to create a purse and kind of with computer software.

Doug: [00:02:06] It took me a few years to realize that that was a lot harder than I thought it would be. I went on to do Internet software developments got a little burned out from that’s who ended up deciding that economics was a great way to to kind of make my small dent in the universe.

Doug: [00:02:26] And I did basically focused on economic research for many years and then it was only about I would say six years ago that I had a chance to teach a class and I loved it and found myself in the shower instead of thinking about how it was going to solve some economic research problem.

Doug: [00:02:47] I was thinking about how I would solve trying to thinking about how it would solve some problem I was having in the classroom for getting some some concept across and I would get excited about teaching things.

Doug: [00:02:57] And it was only probably last year after I had a transition to instead of 15 percent of my time teaching and 85 percent doing research to I would say 85 percent teaching 15 percent of my time doing research that I realized Well well my mom’s a teacher and her mom is a teacher too. And well gosh I guess I guess I’m also a teacher.

Bonni: [00:03:23] Well I’m so happy to have you back on the show and I know you and I actually are still in the process of struggling with what we should even call today’s show because there are so many different ways of referring to learning and teaching as it goes online.

Bonni: [00:03:38] And I know we’re going to start with just this this term small private online classes but it’s not quite going to be descriptive enough so we’ll break that down a little bit but tell me a little bit about how you define a small private online class and especially what it’s not.

Doug: [00:03:55] The classes that I teach, I’ve taught for three summers now in the Yale summer session. They are online classes and they look nothing like these massive online open classes that you hear about in the newspaper and that used to be kind of what everyone thought was the future whole education and now I think people have woken up from a nap and now they have a little bit of a hangover the pendulum swung the other way.

Doug: [00:04:22] But I think online classes can be a lot of different things. And so when I would tell people I teach online it’s there. Oh you have a MOOC, I said, “No, I don’t, actually. I have about between I would say five to 20 students at any given time.

Doug: [00:04:37] My classes are synchronous. So they started a particular time. The students they all have to do the assignments in sync and take exams in sync as opposed to an asynchronous class where anybody can start at any time. Something you would see on say Udacity’s website for example.

Bonni: [00:04:58] There are some parts that are literally at 7 p.m. or 5:00 p.m. and then some parts that just need to be done that week is that correct or before the live session that week live sessions.

Doug: [00:05:11] So the way it’s structured is there’s a recorded video component. So the students are expected to watch about an hour of video before each class and then they show up. And by showing up that means they log in and we use software called Zoom to do this.

Doug: [00:05:29] And I sit at my desk and I have two monitors and one monitor and have my slides that I’m going to use to teach that day and on the other monitor I see a big grid of people and depending on who I’m talking to I say oh it’s like if I’m talking to a younger group I say oh it’s like a Google Hangouts.

Doug: [00:05:48] It’s a little older group I say it’s like the Brady Bunch. And it is a little older I say it’s the Hollywood Squares but basically it’s a big grid of faces and they’re all there. And I say good morning everybody. And we have an hour long class but there’s also exams that particular times and due dates for homework. Everybody has that their homework at a particular time. So and that’s and that’s the way in which it’s synchronous.

Bonni: [00:06:11] On the exam. And I know you’re going to talk a little bit about using Canvas. Is that where the exam is is at.

Doug: [00:06:20] No not at all actually. We’ve we’ve tried a few things we’ve tried three to three years we’ve tried three different exam strategies. So the first year we monitored the exam through the video conferencing software that we were using.

Doug: [00:06:35] So director of the program would watch a few students and I would watch a few students and my my teaching assistant would also watch a few students and at the end of the semester at the end of the term I was really unhappy with that. I felt it was just way too easy to cheat.

Doug: [00:06:56] I had no reason to think any of my students cheated. But a system where it’s easy to cheat eventually is going to get circumvented systematically. And so the next year we had all students had to. All students had to go to a testing center nearby.

Doug: [00:07:17] So we contracted with a firm that managed a network around the world where they think they said something like 90 percent of the world’s population was within a 2 or 3 hour drive of a testing center which is good because we had students that were in Bangkok in Tokyo in Madrid. The toughest one was actually in rural Montana.

Doug: [00:07:48] So she had to drive I think I want to say like eight hours to get to Butte Montana which was where the nearest testing center was.

Bonni: [00:07:57] She stopped at target while she was there and picked up her supplies.

Doug: [00:08:03] Grocery shopping. She was actually she was she was taking the class on a farm and the Internet was best outside. So at one point I made a comment in passing about goats and she said oh I’ve got some goats right here.

Doug: [00:08:19] She turned her laptop and sure enough they were go to find her went to a terrorist group. But that’s I mean that’s the power of the of the online classes. It just opens up the possibilities of who can take it by by a huge amounts.

Doug: [00:08:36] So in this case it was when we will get to this but it’s. We weren’t lowering the price but we were lowering the geographic barriers. So Yale students they often will go off and do crazy things over the summer all around the world. And this was a way for them to also take classes at the same time.

Bonni: [00:08:58] You said there were three things you tried and you listed two like it so I’m having flashbacks to recent presidential debate. You never want to list things especially not with your fingers.

Doug: [00:09:11] Right. Right. There were three. So I can handle that.

Bonni: [00:09:15] OK good.

Doug: [00:09:17] So at the end of that summer I felt like it was just pretty inconvenience. And this it was rock solid in terms of cheating. So I liked that but it was purely inconvenience and the students wouldn’t go and they would have to take the exam at these testing centers using really old software and type in all their answers.

Doug: [00:09:42] And that wasn’t great. I mean this is a math class. So I wanted them to be able to write down equations and it’s a lot faster to do that with a with a pencil or pen and paper than it is to type typing type in their work. And so this past summer we used a web proctoring service where a third party would actually watch each student take their exam at the beginning.

Doug: [00:10:08] They have the students move their laptop camera around to that so that the product can look under their desks and see what they have posted on the wall near them. And the software that they use actually locks down the computer.

Doug: [00:10:25] So they can’t browse the web at the same time. And I felt like after watching them how this was done. Sure cheating is possible but I would say it was about as difficult in this situation as it would be to cheat in a kind of a standard classroom situation. And I think that’s the bar that I wanted to hit was. Are these are these test results as credible as a standard college classroom.

Bonni: [00:10:52] And are you comfortable sharing who you’re using in the approximate price for that price passed on to the students.

Doug: [00:11:00] I don’t think it was high. And I believe that the the firm we used was Examinee.

Bonni: [00:11:06] So tell us about your course then you have Introduction to Econometrics which is officially called Econometrics and Data Analysis one. Tell us about this course.

Doug: [00:11:17] So it’s a course that tries to teach the basics of the basics of probability and statistics as well as basic econometric methods. This is econometrics is very similar to statistics in the sense that it’s a way of learning things about the world by analyzing data.

Doug: [00:11:38] But what’s different about econometrics is it’s a particular set of statistical methods that are designed to set the measure instead of just associations to measure actually causal effects.

Doug: [00:11:51] So we know that’s if you go and you look at data what you’ll find is cities that have very high crime rates also have high numbers of police per capita. Right. This does not mean that as you hire more police that crime increases. But you might want but the relevant policy question is well what happens if I’m going to add one more police officer to the forest what’s that. How is that going to affect the crime rate.

Doug: [00:12:22] These are the kinds of questions you need to know and have answers to in order to optimally hire the right size police force for example. Economists are very interested in writing down kind of models of the economy and then estimating the parameters of those models.

Doug: [00:12:38] So… I know that… People respond to prices when prices go up. Economic theory tells me that people will buy less and buy lower prices. People will buy more but it doesn’t say how much. And so we use econometric methods and data to tell us exactly how price sensitive people are for a particular product or some particular group is to the higher the price for some particular products.

Doug: [00:13:06] It’s a lot to cover. It’s a class that’s very layered. It’s it’s one of these classes were is absolutely critical that you not fall behind because everything builds on what you did the last class. And doing it all in five weeks is a challenge.

Doug: [00:13:25] So the students they watch the video. They watch or they watch usually about five or six 10 minute videos before every class. They take a quiz an online quiz they can take it two times. So I used to have them. I used to let them take the quizzes as many times as they wanted. No what I follow is they would just keep some of the some of my students would not pay any attention to what the answers were.

Doug: [00:13:55] And they would just just keep plugging in answers until they got the right answer. And I don’t want that I want you to try harder each time.

Bonni: [00:14:03] How many questions on each quiz.

Doug: [00:14:06] Ten to 15.

Bonni: [00:14:07] OK. And is it a bank of questions so that if they take it that second time it’s a different question that isn’t always the same?

Doug: [00:14:14] Always the same. And they know what they got wrong and then go back and they can go back and check.

Bonni: [00:14:20] The five to six online videos or these videos of you giving a lecture or someone else or it just depends.

Doug: [00:14:27] They’re all me giving the lecture.

Bonni: [00:14:29] And any advice that you would have for people who are looking to create a bank of small mini lectures like this.

Doug: [00:14:39] So there’s I think there’s two ways you can go about it that work. One is if it’s a class you. You already teach then you can get a camera person in the back of the class and they can film you teaching the class and then you can slice and dice the video into little pieces.

Doug: [00:14:56] And if you know that that’s what’s going to happen they’ll you can tailor your you’re in person and lecture such that’s it will chuck. And so that’s what I did for this class. For other classes I would probably not do that. I would probably do a fairly straightforward kind of talking and screen capture.

Doug: [00:15:18] I don’t think you need super high production values as long as you’re keeping it short and you’re keeping it clear. So I do a whole bunch of things online. I have my professional website @ DougMcKee.net. I’ve got my teaching blog @ teachbetter.co. I’ve got my personal blog for free which is where I blog about all different things for fun. That’s highvariance.net and I have a youtube channel.

Doug: [00:15:48] And YouTube channel just has. Like five to ten short videos about different econometric methods that I made for a different class last last winter. I didn’t advertise them. I just threw them online and I told my 25 students about them. It is by far the most successful thing that I’ve done online in terms of pure numbers.

Doug: [00:16:16] I’ve had the class time I checked I had 35,000 views of these videos and they’re just little videos that I made in my dining room when it was dark like after my kids had gone. I mean they’re not they’re very kind of Khan Academy style.

Doug: [00:16:33] And so you don’t need a big film crew. You don’t need like snazzy any digital effects you just need to be clear and know what you’re doing and communicate it well.

Bonni: [00:16:46] My experience has been that I try to steer people away from filming their live lectures. But you you hit on the way that it can work which is to slice and dice them. But what I see so often is people just have that for example 50 minute lecture and they just record that start to finish and throw it online and think that it’s going to be engaging enough to translate to an online.

Bonni: [00:17:10] And that that really doesn’t work well. So I tend to encourage people especially people who are just starting at this know build a seven to 10 minute video that is built for someone sitting in front of a computer screen.

Doug: [00:17:22] Right. That’s right. Yeah I agree completely.

Bonni: [00:17:25] And it looks like I just went to YouTube video art videos I didn’t know that you had them and they look to me I don’t see your face anywhere but just because that’s the title.

Doug: [00:17:36] No my face doesn’t appear at all.

Bonni: [00:17:39] So you’re filming off of you’re using a screen casting product to create them in which one is that or do you use multiple ones.

Doug: [00:17:47] Those are all done with just Quicktime.

Bonni: [00:17:52] OK. Oh yeah yeah I remember there were some time we were emailing back and forth and I was trying to use some grandiose tool and you were saying just use Quicktime. Quicktime if people are listening or on a Mac you just can record what’s on your screen.

Bonni: [00:18:07] In this case it looks like you’ve recorded a PowerPoint or something of that nature but you could record whatever was on the screen and that will allow you to save it as a video. So we’re not seeing you because you said you were recording it in your dining room that’s where I got confused. You’re recording on your computer of your screen. What they’re looking at.

Doug: [00:18:22] Yeah exactly and the key. OK so a key piece of this is it’s me talking and it’s PowerPoint slides. But a huge amount of those videos is. Using a tablet so I have got a cheap little Wacom tablet that I’ll annotate my slides while I’m talking. So I have horrible handwriting. I do my best.

Doug: [00:18:47] But it just gives it kind of a lot more visual movements I think keeps it more interesting instead of just having everything on the slides.

Bonni: [00:18:58] For people using iPad’s. There’s an app called Explain Everything that would achieve the same results that Doug is describing but you could actually record your voice and do these annotations on your iPad. So people may want to check that one out.

Doug: [00:19:13] I’ve heard great things about Explain Everything.

Bonni: [00:19:16] Well tell us a little bit now that you talked about your class what has worked in terms of all of your evolution of the course. What’s what’s been the keys to making it successful.

Doug: [00:19:27] So the Zoom software for the OK so that there’s the there’s this the the live video components. The Zoom software has been rock solid that we use. So if you go to zoom.us anyone can just download it. It’s software that has very few features.

Doug: [00:19:49] But what it does is it lets you share any window you want. So I can bring up my statistical analysis software and actually analyze data right there and everyone can see it’s I can share my slide share mine PDF that my PDF viewer with my slides and it’s and it’s got a little bit of it of annotations walls.

Doug: [00:20:13] So no matter what window I bring up I can use the Zoom annotation tools to draw on and to point things out. They’ve actually got a brand new feature that I’m super super excited about. They just launched that I’m excited to use it next summer which is breakout rooms. So something I do in my in person glasses I’ll say break into groups of three or four work on this problem.

Doug: [00:20:39] See if you can kind of explain it to each other and then we’ll kind of get back together and we’ll talk about how the different groups solve these the problems with the new software you’re able to actually randomly with a press of a button put throw everything into a separate conference room in groups of three or four from any once.

Doug: [00:21:02] And then hop between these as the instructor easily and then press a button to close them all down and bring everybody back all at once that I feel like is one of the big things. One of the one of the only things that I can’t do now and my online classes that I can do in person class. There’s a lot of different products out there that do video conferencing.

Doug: [00:21:28] I think getting the right one makes a pretty big difference. Having a good learning management system behind the class. So I use Canvas by Instructure and it’s very flexible. I can have the course websites look exactly like I want it to.

Doug: [00:21:45] I think for an online classes is critical. We also at Yale some of us use it for our in person classes. I mean it competes with things like Blackboard and there’s a whole bunch of other products like this one feature I like a lot is it’s got very good support for online quizzes.

Doug: [00:22:05] And those have been critical to get students actually watching the video. Third piece is actually paying attention to who’s watching the video. So a lot of the software that we use for the video actually keeps track of who watches what’s. And so I can tell hey. So and so it looks like you haven’t been watching the videos before class you might want to get on that.

Bonni: [00:22:33] Is the software that you are using to tell if they watched the video is that by embedding the video in Canvas or is that something else.

Doug: [00:22:42] We’ve been using Kaltura which I’m not sure Kaltura is something we’re going to continue using and I wish the logging was better. But that’s what we’ve been using.

Bonni: [00:22:58] Are they served up from inside of canvas. But it’s just in the background, Kaltura is…

Doug: [00:23:02] The key thing is that it puts like an I.D. wall in between. So students have to log in in order to access the video and once they log in we can tell who they are and keep track of what they’re watching what they’re not.

Bonni: [00:23:16] Got it. That makes sense.

Doug: [00:23:17] I mean if they really wanted to game it they could play and go do something else. But that’s not really that’s not usually what’s going on. Usually they want to watch the news didn’t get around to. But the quizzes are key to make sure that they actually come to the live sessions prepared and the quizzes are served up you said on Canvas on Canvas allows you to quotes mathematical equations into the questions and into the answers which is really great.

Bonni: [00:23:45] And they are not proctored those those.

Doug: [00:23:48] No. low stakes. One thing that doesn’t work and I think this is true all of our flipped classes. So these are the kinds of online classes that I teach are very much like what you would see university experimenting with in terms of a flipped classroom.

Doug: [00:24:06] They watch the video outside and then they show up for the live sessions my live sessions just happen to happen to be remote ready to work. And so something that that doesn’t work is they come with questions about the material and then we’ll talk.

Doug: [00:24:24] I have tried that. I want that to work. I feel like it should work and it totally does not work and it’s never worked. They show up. They don’t have they don’t have any questions. And so what I do is I come with questions and so most of the sessions that we start off and I say. All right. Do you have questions no.

Doug: [00:24:45] OK I’ve got questions and then I go around the room and I say well what about this. How would you answer this question. What about this. How about this. And it becomes very clear very quickly that they didn’t really understand the material as deeply as they thought they did and a lot of learning happened during those during those live sessions through the Socratic methods.

Bonni: [00:25:10] And in the Socratic method. You’re actually calling on specific students. Julie what do you.

Doug: [00:25:15] Yes.

Bonni: [00:25:15] How would you answer this? And that does probably increase the likelihood that I’ll be less tempted to go and start checking other social media while we’re on the session. I think it might be called on.

Doug: [00:25:28] And they can’t they. Most of them are on laptops so their screen isn’t big enough for them to watch social media things. And you could be in the class and see the slides that are going by in.

Doug: [00:25:42] And I can see their eyes. And so and another big advantage to the online is their names show up under their. Under their faces. And so I never have to I never forget a name I should also say that. So what does work in. In the live sessions is a lot of structure.

Doug: [00:26:02] So and then this structure it lightens up somewhat as the term goes on as they learn more. They give them kind of longer problems to work on. But what I don’t do is expect them to come prepared and just talk.

Bonni: [00:26:20] Yeah. You were talking about that your lab sessions are very active and you create a lot of variety could you give us a couple of examples of that.

Doug: [00:26:28] So my favorite live session actually is near the end of the term. And what I do is I give them data from the from about the Titanic. So I give them a data set where each observation is a passenger that was on the Titanic.

Doug: [00:26:46] And it’s a lot of a bunch of characteristics like their sex their age relatives they had onboard. What class of ticket they had where they got on the on the boat and whether they survived or not. And I have them constructs models to try to predict which of these characteristics actually protects survival.

Doug: [00:27:12] So was it women and children firsts were the first class passengers more likely to get spots on a lifeboat than than the third class passengers. And. And so what I do is I break them into these small groups. This was a lot harder before when you didn’t have this breakout room feature but you could still do it with multiple conference rooms.

Doug: [00:27:35] And I would go from conference room to conference room and see what they were working on and see them working together and kind of push them along in different places. And that worked that works pretty well.

Doug: [00:27:47] Another time we had them read papers that applied the methods that we had learned. And then we had them explain to me what the tables in the papers meant. And like what do we actually learn from these these research articles.

Bonni: [00:28:05] That all sounds fascinate. I want to know what the answer was.

Doug: [00:28:09] Women and children first and the first class folks got in the lifeboats because their cabins were closer to the to the dock. But people really did like they said they sent the women and the children into the boats first. Yeah. And we’re likely to survive if you’re female or you were a child.

Bonni: [00:28:28] What are some things that haven’t worked mistakes that you’ve made that you now have since corrected.

Doug: [00:28:35] Oh boy. With the online testing that we did the first time around was a disaster. Let me give you one good example. So this this summer the technology actually stayed the same. But what changed. But I still wanted to change something because I always have to change something and try to make things better.

Doug: [00:28:57] And what I did is I added a group projectI wanted to run it in my big lecture class this fall. But I decided I would pilot it over the summer since I was running. I taught the online class once in June and then again in July.

Doug: [00:29:11] And so in June I didn’t really know what I wanted. I wanted them to do these projects. I wanted them to propose questions that they cared about and they couldn’t answer at the beginning. Even though they hadn’t they didn’t know the tools that they were using. And I didn’t really know what I I knew what I wanted the intermediate deliverables to be but I’m not in detail.

Doug: [00:29:40] And so it didn’t actually go all that well. That first time through and it looked at my course evaluations one of the one person said really clearly. I didn’t know what he wanted at the beginning and it wasn’t until the very end when it passed in the project that I actually felt like I understood what it what was wanted.

Doug: [00:29:59] And so what I did during the semester is every time someone would ask me a question about the projects I would answer them and I would go back and I would edit the assignments. So the answer was already in the assignments.

Doug: [00:30:11] And then after I received the first deliverable and what I called the Data description and I said oh this is what they pass then. This is I like this I don’t like this. I made a rubric. OK and then I go by. Yea and I graded the projects based on the rubric and then we handed it back. Well when I taught it in the second session I handed out the rubrics for the assignments at the very beginning.

Doug: [00:30:36] So they knew what they were getting into. And so the first time around. I guess that it wasn’t something that I knew that it was going to go badly. I also knew that I was going to gather a lot of good information and it would go better the next time been.

Bonni: [00:30:53] Well this is the point in the show when we get to recommendations and I’m watching the clock because I know you have an appointment so I’m going to have you go first.

Doug: [00:30:59] So I tried something new in my seminar class last spring. All my students all semester long I had about 25 of them worked very hard on these research projects and I knew that I wanted them to be able to share what they learned and that hard work with their peers in the class.

Doug: [00:31:24] Instead of just throwing it over the wall to me and then walking away. At the end of the semester and so some classes I know will do things like have student presentations like 5 minute presentations and I always feel like a death march. Students get out. They give their little presentation. It’s kind of slow it goes okay and a lot of people are just kind of bored and it takes a lot hour class time.

Doug: [00:31:50] But there’s a class at Harvard it’s very famous called CS50. David Malan teaches it. And a big component of this class it’s an introductory computer science class is a project Fair at the end of the semester where he has all of the students that have done projects.

Doug: [00:32:07] They they they basically get together in a very large space. There’s music there’s food there’s balloons and it’s half party and half sharing. And I said I want that’s for my class. And so what I did in the spring is I said we’re going to have a poster session. And so it was kind of a cross between The CS50 project fair and a hard science conference poster session where I had the students.

Doug: [00:32:38] I broke up I broke the class into three groups and I had the first group present their research on posters. It was actually in a technology class a tech what we call the TEAL classroom here at Yale the technology enabled active learning classroom and.

Doug: [00:33:00] When the first round. Eight students put up their posters describing their work on big screens that were that are all around the edge of the room and the rest of the students wandered around. There was we had music. It was a it was a class on economics in Latin America. So I had Latin music and I brought a bunch of food and drinks.

Doug: [00:33:24] And it was fun. And then at the end of that round everyone voted on what was the best poster and what was the best projects because those two things that not always the same.

Doug: [00:33:37] And then I gave it a little award and it was very low stakes in terms of their grade. But everyone takes pride in their work. And it was much more about sharing what you’ve done than trying to get a good grade. And it was great.

Doug: [00:33:52] We did it outside class than we did in the evening. And it was so fun I’m going to do planning to do it this semester. During the last week of classes in the evening with a class of about 120 where we had group projects instead of individual projects. So it’s about 30 different groups.

Doug: [00:34:13] Break them into three rounds run at the same way. And I would highly recommend anyone else that has students doing projects and I know there are a lot of classes like this to do something like an end of semester poster session.

Bonni: [00:34:28] I have linked in the show notes which will be at teachinginhighered.com/76 to your blog that you wrote about the same topic so people can find out more.

Doug: [00:34:37] Yeah that’s that Scott. It’s got pictures of the spring poster session that I did.

Bonni: [00:34:43] I also linked to the CS50 course Web site and that looks like a really good model for laying out course resources.

Doug: [00:34:52] It’s incredible. It’s incredible what that class does everything in an extreme way. We actually interviewed David Malan On a recent episode of the Teach Better podcast where he explains why. He makes all of these fairly extreme decisions and teaching that class. That’s a cost that’s that’s being co taught this year across Harvard and Yale.

Doug: [00:35:14] He’s got about 350 Yale students right now. And a lot more students also at Harvard. He’s teaching in both places.

Bonni: [00:35:22] It was so much fun to listen to that episode. I’ll link to that in the show notes too. They even have a class DJ which they do.

Doug: [00:35:29] They sure do.

Bonni: [00:35:31] Well thank you so much for carving out time today to be on the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast. And it’s actually this is going to air before Thanksgiving. And so what a perfect time to say how thankful I am for you that I got to meet you and have had you on the show and consider you my friend.

Doug: [00:35:47] I feel exactly exactly the same way.

Bonni: [00:35:50] It was so great having Doug on the show once again and I had lost track of time and wanted to let him go meet with a student that he had set prior arrangements with. I’m giving my recommendations solo today and I’m going to recommend Sherlock.

Bonni: [00:36:05] Sherlock is a British drama and it is from the characters and Detective plots of Sherlock Holmes. And it is from. It is set in early 21st century London. And what I love about Sherlock is it’s just got such great characters and such tremendous acting.

Bonni: [00:36:27] There are currently three seasons and each each season only has three episodes around 110 minutes each and there’s a special episode that’s going to be between the third and fourth season that’s coming out on January the 1st. My recommendation is to watch those first three seasons of Sherlock and enjoy the great plot and great acting that happens and then you’ll be ready for January 1st 2016.

Bonni: [00:36:57] Thanks everyone for listening to Teaching in Higher Ed. Thanks again to Doug for being on the show again. And I just want to encourage everyone to make sure that you have subscribed to our weekly updates and that’s where you’ll get the show notes and a blog. Once a week about teaching Or productivity in your inbox without having to do a thing.

Bonni: [00:37:19] To subscribe you just go to teachinginhighered.com/subscribe. And when you do you will receive the free ed tech essentials ebook. That has 19 tools to help you integrate technology into your teaching and productivity. Thanks once again for listening. And we’ll see you next time.

Teaching in Higher Ed transcripts are created using a combination of an automated transcription service and human beings. This text likely will not represent the precise, word-for-word conversation that was had. The accuracy of the transcripts will vary. The authoritative record of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcasts is contained in the audio file.