Bonni: [00:00:00] Today on episode number 245 on the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast, Dr. Terri Jett shares about the fullness of our humanity as teachers and students.

Production Credit: [00:00:14] Produced by Innovate Learning, maximizing human potential.

Bonni: [00:00:23] Hello and welcome to this episode of Teaching in Higher Ed. I’m Bonni Stachowiak and this is the space where we explore the art and science of being more effective at facilitating and learning. We also share ways to improve our productivity approaches so we can have more peace in our lives and be even more present for our students.

Bonni: [00:00:50] Today’s guest was introduced to me through my partnership that I have with ACUE, that’s the Association of College and University Educators and about once a month they send over a wonderful guest. I’ve never been anything but delighted by all the people I get to meet through that connection I have with them. And today’s guest is no exception. Terri Jett is originally from Richmond, California.

[00:01:16] She has a Bachelor’s in Ethnic Studies and an MP from CSU Hayward and aPh.D. in Public Policy and Public Administration from Auburn University. Currently she is an associate professor of political science and affiliate faculty member of the gender women and sexuality studies program. The Peace and Conflict Studies program and special assistant to the provost for diversity and inclusively at Butler University. Her research interests and writings focused primarily around post civil rights area community and economic development as well as empowering pedagogical practices that create inclusive curricular and code curricular spaces.

Bonni: [00:02:00] Terri Jett, welcome to Teaching in Higher Ed. Thank you. I’m thrilled to talk to you. There are so many avenues we could go down, but I’d like to start at the beginning and I’d like to have you talk a little bit about how you became a teacher.

Terri: [00:02:14] Yes I became a teacher sort of based on my experience as a child which I have talked about and written about. But it’s so prevalent to the why I do what I do is that as a black child I would bus to school and it just really affected me in terms of knowing that somebody thought that that was a good idea to have me leave my neighborhood, my community and go to a school that was kind of far away to get a better education.

Terri: [00:02:49] And so it has influenced me into really exploring first of all for pooling in two different disciplines that shaped my background. I have a degree in ethnic studies which I married with the discipline of political science and public policy. But then also pushed me into looking at the experiences of young people and children just in the classroom and who really kind of owns that space and then further into academia and to being someone hopefully that can be present for students that come from kind of nontraditional sort of backgrounds, as far as academia is concerned and that we have just as much of a right to be in that space and to explore knowledge and ideas especially with regard to things that shape our own lives.

Bonni: [00:03:46] Can you take me back to the bus? An early memory that you have and what was that like? What were the sights and smells and sounds? And what were you thinking as a young girl?

Terri: [00:03:58] Well I had a lot of time to think because the bus ride was a good hour to get from my home to the actual school. And the school that I went to was really good. Kensington Elementary School, I want to give a shout out to that school, it was a good school. But my bus stop was around the corner from where I lived. And I would stand on this corner and the corner was across the street from an elementary school and the elementary school was ironically named Martin Luther King Elementary School.

Terri: [00:04:28] I’m standing there looking at this school. Like what? You know, that’s named after Martin Luther King. How come I’m not going to that school? And I had a couple of friends that were with me. I was in an all black neighborhood basically. So it was like a few of us were plucked out of our neighborhood, put on this bus, and then sent into this community that’s kind of in the Berkeley hills. I guess that’s how I describe it, Kensington.

Bonni: [00:04:53] Do you remember asking other adults at the time why this was happening? To explain this long bus ride?

Terri: [00:05:02] Yeah I only asked my parents. I didn’t ask anybody else. And my parents basically said well that school you tested out of that school. And I actually don’t remember taking any test. But it’s important, I believe, to tell this story because I want people to understand that the experiences of children- I think everybody understands that. But especially in terms of the educational experiences so much shaped our lives so they can go- they could take a turn for the worse or they can embolden children. And I feel like that experience sort of emboldened me to have this sort of activist spirit that I’m not just going to take everything that’s coming to me in society. That I’m going to ask the questions as to why is this happening?

Terri: [00:05:54] And if I can do something about it, I’m going to do something about it. Or at least I’m going to bring some attention to it. So somebody, whoever’s in power can do something. So that is part of why I teach a class on activism. And I teach a lot of classes that have that at the heart like don’t just sit there and take it, you do something about it. Make a statement, even if it’s small. Bring some attention to it. Or if you can do something, do something about it.

Bonni: [00:06:22] So we know something about you as a little girl and how even at that age you can recall that activist fire starting to light inside of you. What did that look like in college? And especially what were those early classes like that you remember?

Terri: [00:06:39] Well my college experience was really kind of trying. It took me a while to get my undergraduate degree. I could not get a handle on the system because I didn’t come from- I had family members, some that went to college but my parents, my mother went to nursing school, they had kind of different paths and so I didn’t have the knowledge about what it meant to really kind of go to college in the way that a lot of families have passed that to one another from one generation to another.

Terri: [00:07:11] So I had to sort of find my way and land in a place which I finally did at a California State University in Hayward and in the ethnic studies department because it was very clear to me that I needed to have mentors and professors that I could relate to. And it was kind of hard to find in the sort of university arena, unless you chose something like that.

Bonni: [00:07:38] Yeah, yeah.

Terri: [00:07:39] And I was a work study student and I also worked. And so that was what it was. But what I will say about the ethnic studies department is that it was the most nurturing and wonderful college experience. And as a work studies student, I worked in that department. So I really became close to my professors. And our classes were usually smaller. And we could really dig into the information and I was allowed the space and the freedom to ask those questions. And also, what I was learning was so deeply personal for me.

Terri: [00:08:13] And so how that informs me as a professor is I’m trying to understand what the students are seeking themselves. As far as their learning experience. And I understand that they’re seeking their degree, they need to get a job, they need the money. I get it. As someone that comes from a working class background so I also understand and love the idea of knowledge for knowledge sake.

Terri: [00:08:42] So I’m trying to reach across all of those students and speak to all of them like yeah, I love knowledge too. I also understand the practical aspects. I understand you have knowledge that you need in order to survive and to be successful and to thrive. And so I’m drawing on my own experiences as a child, as a college student, and using that to inform what I teach and the way I teach it. And I’m actually very thankful that I do have an institution that is allowing me, that has allowed me to do that. I’ve been at Butler for almost 20 years now.

Bonni: [00:09:23] Race has always been a part of your intersectional identity and you have told such beautiful stories about that. I’d love to have you share a little bit more about then, now you’re taking this intersectional identity into a new context, teaching college students. And what learnings did you experience about- because it’s not only you know part of your identity, but it’s also part of what you want to teach them as someone teaching about politics and public policy and women’s studies, etc. Like what were your early observations abou oh this is going to go just as I planned or wow there’s some surprises now that it’s within this context of trying to educate these students? And in this case a predominantly white institution.

Terri: [00:10:10] Yes well something that at least I didn’t learn very much about as a graduate student was student evaluations. And that’s where you really get a lesson in your classroom experience. And I see so many women of color talk about this today. But that’s where I have really learned about what I teach and how I teach it. And it’s not that I have necessarily adjusted that much. I have adjusted some based on the responses I’ve got from students. But the most important part is I’ve learned to develop a thick skin. And that’s what you learn when you’re teaching the courses that I’m teaching in a predominantly white institution.

Terri: [00:10:56] And I feel it’s important not to even try to compromise yourself. And this is really difficult especially for people on the tenure track. They need those good evaluations from students. And yet you would get responses that you’re not sure where they are coming from. And also they are not based in what you were saying in the class.

Terri: [00:11:23] So for example, I’ll use the issue of bias. There is an expectation that you should be, especially in political science courses a lot, that you should be kind of objective and there should be no bias. I have never made claim to that and in fact I have deliberately said “if you are expecting this black woman to teach US politics and for some sort of bias not to come out, for me to be some sort of robot, you’re in the wrong classroom. It is not going to happen.” When I’m teaching about the framers, when I’m teaching about the slavery compromise, I’m teaching about the civil rights movement, that’s personal. As it should be personal for you too.

Terri: [00:12:08] So I want to hear your responses to what I’m saying. I want you to respond to these policies and these institutions, the way things were framed in the Constitution and the challenges that we’ve had. I want you to take that personally, especially if you are a U.S. citizen and this is your country. And so don’t expect me to not take it personal also.

Terri: [00:12:33] And so I have even used texts that I knew were clearly biased. And in fact, I would tell the students hey it’s ok to disagree with me and the text, feel free. One text I used was actually all about elite theory. Some may be familiar with it. It is called The Irony of Democracy and it’s just talking about how the whole U.S. political system was designed to benefit the elites. And I would say very clearly that this is all based on elite theory. This is really about a particular perspective of the U.S. political system. This is not your standard American government textbook. And go ahead and disagree with it. I would open that up and at the end the student evaluations would be “oh my God, she was so bias” and my response would be, I told you it was biased but I gave you the space to disagree with that.

Terri: [00:13:29] And so then as a faculty member and this was all during a tenure track, I haven’t changed from being pre-tenure to being tenured. I always maintain this. And I’m glad I did because I did not want to compromise myself. But I then had to explain myself and make sure I had this very clearly documented that no, the students were not paying attention or they didn’t get it. And it’s not all the students. It wasn’t even that many. But it’s still that no, I clearly spelled out that I am teaching in a deliberate way, making sure to understand my perspective because being a part of a political system is really about understanding why we all think the way we do. So I want them to tell me what they think, I’m telling them what I think.

Terri: [00:14:20] And yes, there is a power dynamic but I’m trying to create the space to allow for those conversations to happen because this is really important. Especially if I’ve got these students that are going to go into whatever type of careers and have some influence on my life. So I need them to be clear on why they’re making the decision that they’re making because it’s going to affect somebody.

Bonni: [00:14:47] I’ve been at this about 15 years now. And I remember early on that a couple of teachers specifically who I really admired, their expressed ideal was that students would never know what they thought about things. By the way, white men. And so I thought that was for many years more than a decade that’s how I’m supposed to be. And then I remember there have been many podcast guests who have said first of all you’re kidding yourself to say that- teaching is political. So guess what, if you are teaching, you are political and to think that you could disguise that it may not come out in healthy ways. And again, I’m not doing their words justice right now but really I’m wrestling with this and how it’s shaping. But with our current state of politics in our country right now, I can no longer manage that anymore. I can’t do it.

Bonni: [00:15:43] But part of as you’re describing this, Terri, is that I think that there is a luxury that some teachers can have to think that they’re completely neutral, I mean to think that that’s actually what they’re accomplishing. That’s a luxury that you don’t get to take first of all. But then secondly, it’s almost a safer route, I kind of think because to let ourselves be that whole person in the classroom- and that’s what you’ve just described in your story, that’s the more dangerous route. But that’s why you became a teacher.

Terri: [00:16:24] Yeah, exactly. And you know who decided in this academic arena that I didn’t create, who decided that neutrality was the best tool? Because I don’t think that it is. And also I didn’t have that experience as an undergrad. So I’m not sure what it means to have a teacher- and also looking at it from the student perspective. I’m glad I wasn’t a student sitting there listening to someone talk about the Bill of Rights from this kind of neutral standpoint. And I’m really glad I didn’t have that. I’m part of the ACLU here in the state. And I want students to know that, that I am a part of that organization and that I use some things I learn in that arena to inform what I’m doing in the classroom. So what do they expect me to do with the knowledge that I gain outside of the classroom? Just leave it there? Or bring it into the classroom from some objective standpoint when I’ve been right in the middle of it myself? And that’s not going to happen.

Terri: [00:17:42] If I’m talking about busing and educational policies like that, am I supposed to deny that I had that experience as a child? And just talk about it like it’s just some sort of policy that was written and use this data to inform how many students went to school? And did the graduation rates increase? What does that all mean? We are talking about people and communities. And you’re right. It’s a luxury for people to and I would say predominatley men, white men to have that particular standpoint but I don’t think the students are fooled by that. Especially the students today. Especially with all the technology and their access to information about us that they have. So you can stand there and try to present material in a certain way, but they’re going to run into you somewhere, they’re going to see speaking about something, they’re going to be aware of the text that you’re presenting, they’re going to look up other things and they’re going to recognize whatever biases that you’re bringing into the classroom.

Terri: [00:18:54] But on my main point or sort of my original point was that as a faculty person of color on a predominantly white campus you have to be clear on how you are presenting yourself and then also how you’re going to be judged because you still want to have a level of success. So you can’t just be completely free. You also have to be aware of the dynamics of the institution that say well these are the requirements in order to move up in the ranks. And there’s a compromise that happens, but there’s a compromise that happens within any organization unless you are running your own organization. And even then you have to make compromises. So that’s important I think especially young faculty to understand that you can push the boundaries a little bit but you also have to be practical.

Bonni: [00:19:53] There are two themes I heard you talking about back then. I didn’t want to miss the first which one was you very clearly said and you want to hear what they have to say. So it’s not like you’re saying I want to come in and tell them how to think, but you’re not going to pretend that you don’t have thoughts about these things that you have studied and also experienced. But then you’re leaving that space, and that room, and that hunger from your standpoint. You do want to hear that.

Bonni: [00:20:17] And then the second thing, you talked about learning how to play the game in these various contexts. What learning how to play the game with student evaluations, you don’t want to give up, you don’t want to compromise yourself in the process is what you said. But one approach that I have found helpful for me to not give up parts of myself in that, what bias comes out of me being a woman teaching in a context like that is to point out and be even more transparent about what I am doing and why I am doing it and how I am here to serve them in that process.

Bonni: [00:20:49] And sometimes yes, I may even you know point to one of the things I’ll ask you to evaluate me on or just it helps to identify that they are going to be asked to evaluate us as teachers at the end. Sadly like that just makes your evaluations go up, just when you ask them how they are experiencing your class, that midpoint class evaluation like if you didn’t change a thing about how you teach or compromise your identity that kind of thing, still having a mid class or those periodic checks along the way of how people are experiencing their learning can really help even though it’s still dreadful and not going to change all the biases that are inherent in student evaluations.

Terri: [00:21:29] Yes and it’s also critical to have someone come into your classroom and observe to have an understanding of the different dynamics that are happening and have a consciousness about them, about what your experience and your presentation and how that affects the students. But I think also you’re right. That constant checking in. I know most of my peers have very extensive syllabi, that’s important. And I think it’s important to go through the syllabus in the middle of the semester to remind students that you are organized, so that is not one of those things that comes up to you like “oh they’re so disorganized” when something shifts or changes. And it’s like no, I am still right on task. I know what I’m doing. Because you have to maintain the authority in the classroom which is another point that I want to make.

Terri: [00:22:19] Students do will refer to me as Dr. Jett, and they don;t call me anything but that. And that’s important because- and lots of women experience this, and I hear about it like in e-mails you get, you’re not referred to properly or just to the presentation, you have to maintain sort of that authority in the classroom. It’s just very critical. And yet you can also be an approachable, accessible faculty member.

Terri: [00:22:51] And another point I want to raise about creating this sort of safe space for this really good communication between faculty and students is that I’m also clear with the students that they can challenge me on things that I say and throughout different ideas, but their ideas aren’t going to go without challenge either. It’s important to have that trust in place and to be able to have that exchange because it is a learning environment. So they can’t just even though you’re saying yes, you’re free to express yourself but you have to have something behind that, the lived experience, but also the information, the resources, the knowledge that reaffirm and define what you’re saying and the perspective you are giving. That’s important.

Bonni: [00:23:38] One of the things I went back and change about a course that I’m teaching for maybe the third or fourth time was that I want them to change their mind about something, I actually put that in as one of the top four or five big goals I have for the class. And my constant evolving with my approach to teaching, to me, that’s going to help me do what you just said better that it doesn’t have to be that I’m correct in the sense of shame or you know expecting them to be accountable for what they say but it’s a class or a know controversial topics are going to come up, it’s inherent in the topic and yet, I felt like if we opened up that room that my goodness gracious can we all be changing in our mind about things? That’s an important part of their learning process while they’re in college. But I also like to model that gosh those of us that are older than them or further advanced in our education than they are, guess what we also change our mind about things as we are encountered with new information. I was thinking- I was listening to a podcast interview about a guy who ten years of his career was all about nucular power. And today he’s going “Yeah I don’t think it’s a good source of power.” That was his field for ten years like we should do this. By the way for listeners who don’t already know this about me, I know nothing about nuclear power. What resonated with me about this interview was my goodness this man’s got a Ph.D. in physics, ten years of his work is advocating to get the U.S. to use more nucular power and he today is saying you know what, I don’t think that any more not after the earthquake and the tsunami. I mean my goodness can we all leave room for us to change our minds no matter how much education we have or how much we have to offer in terms of our knowledge. I thought it was like- I was happy with the way that that turned out.

Terri: [00:25:33] You know that is really interesting and it makes me think of another aspect of things that I’ve learned as far as my teaching and that is how we assess students. I know that I’m not alone when I say that’s the worst part of my job and I hate it. So then I try to be creative in what I have to grade so that I’m not so bored with what I’m grading. But then also that things are so competitive these days and especially students are so competitve with one another, they really rely upon that sort of that grading aspect or what grade are they going to get? And what do they need to get this you know grade? So you could be talking about changing your mind or different ways of thinking differently but they’re sitting there thinking ok yeah, but what do I need to get an A?

Bonni: [00:26:30] Yeah, yeah.

Terri: [00:26:32] And is getting it wrong going to cause me some harm where I don’t end up with that A? Yeah, it is like you have got to create those assignments that allow for that but then you also have to create assignments that do say ok, no you’re going to have to bring something to let me know that you’ve learned something.

Bonni: [00:26:55] There are two movements that are just so powerful to this end. One is the idea that our assignments should be constantly changing and that we should be honoring the work that the students put in. One example would be Jesse Stommel is someone who regularly says maybe we shouldn’t be on social media venting about how terrible our lives are for having degrades students work when wouldn’t it be nice if we celebrated that this is evidence of their learning? And wow I get to experience this. By the way I’m guilty. I don’t want to say like I hold myself to too high of a standard here. But that has shaped my thinking.

Bonni: [00:27:33] And then also it can reduce lack of academic integrity. James Lang is someone who has spoke about you want to have fewer incidents of plagiarism, well don’t assign the same thing every darn semester and have it be on a current thing that is happening right now. I mean it depends what class you’re teaching, etc.

Bonni: [00:27:52] But then and then the other thing is the un-grading movement which we’ve had a couple of episodes, one focused on that and one that the subject came up. But just the idea of you know when it’s all just this game of What does it take to get the A vs what if it’s instead about that learning process. That’s one way and I don’t want to go on too much of a tangent because there’s one thing I haven’t asked you about that I don’t want to get to our recommendation segment without asking you about, and that is you teach an entirely different context from Butler and I’d love for the listeners get to hear a little bit about that experience and what you’ve learned from it.

Terri: [00:28:29] Yes well I teach at the Indiana Women’s Prison and I teach a course on Alice Walker. And actually it is the same course that I teach at my university at Butler. And the reason why I teach that is because, well that’s my favorite author, and also because I like the way that she writes kind of about her life and reveals a lot and uses humor and uses all different types of styled poems and short stories, she also writes essays and novels. And so there is so much you can do with her material.

Terri: [00:29:10] But teaching in the women’s prison is also very rewarding for me. And it’s not like I’m saying look at me I’m so good, I’m going into this prison it’s because the students that I work with that are incarcerated and have these various experiences are bringing so much to the material and our conversations and their writings and discussions around that are so rich and rewarding. And also I get an insight into something that I do teach about which is the criminal justice system.

Terri: [00:29:51] So it gives me a firsthand experience of what it means to a certain extent, a very limited extent, but to be part of this kind of prison industrial system. Just because walking in there you feel very much the constraints of going into that space and how you are controlled even as someone that’s just there temporarily. I’m there just once a week for three hours.

Terri: [00:30:22] But then also you get to meet some wonderful people who have experienced some tragedies, maybe have even engaged in some horrific things. I don’t ask them too many questions about that but when they start writing about their lives, I learn a lot just about the human experience. And also just about the experiences of women from all different types of backgrounds.

Terri: [00:30:50] And I’ve brought my students from Butler into that space also because I think it’s an important experience for them to learn and it really emphasizes what I’m talking about to them that look I’m looking at you all as people that are going to be leaders that are going to make decisions maybe policy decisions that are going affect people’s lives. And I want you to be face to face with the lives that you may possibly affect based on your decisions that you make. And that is, for me, really rewarding and the students from the sort of I guess it’s traditional students that I teach and I have brought into that space have said to me each one, have said that that was a life changing experience for them. And they were only in there maybe once or twice.

[00:31:38] Terry Jette thank you so much for sharing all these amazing stories about your life. You’re a fascinating person to me and I’m just hoping that you’ll come back soon. I know you’re you’re on sabbatical now and there’s lots more to do.

Bonni: [00:31:51] But before we end today’s episode we have the fun part of getting to share our recommendations. I say fun because sometimes we share things that relate to the episode. Sometimes it’s something more eclectic. I wanted to share quickly that I’m becoming really even more fascinated by the power of what I’ll call sorting exercises. And sorting exercises specifically on paper.

Bonni: [00:32:16] So I just did this a couple of days ago. I’m teaching a business ethics course and I pulled out a couple- this is actually a published material- a couple of really old case studies around business ethics that actually takes it out of the context of business first and has the participants sort medical research elements from most ethical to least ethical with the idea in mind that your audience, your participants don’t know anything about medical research so taking them out of the context of business having them sort whether it’s ok to pay someone to participate, or should you pay them based on how risky their research is? What about when children are involved? That’s the kinds of things that they sorted. That’s a published one but I’ve made many of these on my own too.

Bonni: [00:33:00] So another example of sorting isn’t necessarily sorting in one dimension. Like most to least. But also helping students create maps of things. So I always think like I make assumptions about students that they know about economic systems that they often don’t. So even just like I have all these strips of paper some of them are categories like types of economic systems and then the other cards are socialism, communism, capitalism. And then mixed economic systems which of course the vast majority of today’s economies are. And so but that’s just one example of a category. There’s all these different categories. So by about week three or week four in a class, what our weakness often is is to just cover more and more material. We are going onto week 7 and we’re covering and covering and covering and not recognizing the importance of stepping back and helping students test their knowledge map. Because we don’t know, we just assume because we had this whole frame of knowledge in our mind walking into it. We already have the map of knowledge and we’re just thinking we will just pour it out. I’ll just pour it out into their heads.

Bonni: [00:34:11] But there is something specific to me about giving them something physical to sort, whether they sort it on a desk or they sort it and then post it somewhere in the room, sticky notes, whatever. But having it in their hands, it’s one of the ways you can really negate the temptation for them to pull out any kind of digital device and potentially be distracted by that.

Bonni: [00:34:33] So I mean there’s just a really powerful thing rather than “put those things away you young whippersnappers” instead we can say “here’s something for you to do.” And I mean I never have had to mention that this isn’t a great time to use our cell phones because I mean it’s just never come up because they’re so engaged in this. There is just something about having it in your hand.

Bonni: [00:34:52] So my recommendation today is to use sorting exercises, there’s a lot of them that already exist. You could use from other educators but there’s also really low hanging fruit opportunities to build your own and just do it real informal. I’m sitting there with my scissors cutting these things up and putting them in envelopes and having them there for the students. So that’s my recommendation. And Terri thank you for letting me go on about that. You can tell I’m passionate about that. It’s been really fun to experiment with. And I’d love to hear what you have to recommend today.

Terri: [00:35:22] Well that’s so funny thing when you said sorting I immediately went to what I’m doing to balance my writing, my working on a book for my sabbatical it is all on farming and farm justice. And so I am reading a lot of stuff really about the food justice movement and especially with women and people of color kind of reclaiming agriculture. But to balance all of that I’m using the Marie Kondo method of de-cluttering my life also. So I’ve been watching that show that everybody is talking about, it’s about tidying up and going through your clothes first and going through this process and then finally getting to the misc. So when you said sorting I immediately went to Marie Kondo with all my clothes that are on top of my bed. She said to pile all your clothes on your bed.

Terri: [00:36:13] So I’ve been doing that but also I want to just recommend that people revisit the work of Dr. Martin Luther King. He would have been 90 years old this year and I’m discussing out in the community some of his works. Actually tonight I’ll be discussing a letter from a Birmingham Jail and so much that he wrote in that is relevant to today.

Terri: [00:36:37] And then also James Baldwin- I’m also looking at this conversation and writing about this that Margaret Mead had with James Baldwin in August of 1970. And so that conversation will 50 years in 2020. And they had a conversation over a two day period about race. I mean there is a book about it’s called Margaret Mead James Baldwin, A Rap on Race. And I believe that a lot of things that we’re wrestling with were things that were wrestled with 50 years ago. So many things happened. We have celebrated so many anniversaries, civil rights movement, voting rights movement, women’s movement, LGBT movement, all of these things have kind of this foundation of the not too distant past. And so that’s kind of what I’m recommending that people look at some of the works that came from those individuals today. And use that to inform how they look at what’s happening and also how to teach to students and reintroduce that material to students.

Bonni: [00:37:43] What a delight it was to be introduced to you from a ACUE, I’m so grateful to them for that connection. And thank you today for this rich conversation. And I am just so looking forward to other people getting to hear this episode and hearing their responses to it. This has just been a wonderful delight to get to talk to you, and an honor.

Terri: [00:38:02] Well thank you Bonni. I’m honored to be a part of the podcast. It’s pretty amazing. I’m learning so much from all the people that you have as guests. I appreciate it.

Bonni: [00:38:11] I’m so glad. Terri Jett, what a pleasure it was to get to speak with you today. And thanks to all of you who are listening in and reflecting on your own teaching and the ways in which you can bring the fullness of you into the classroom and allow students to do the same.

Bonni: [00:38:33] And if this is something you’d be interested in learning more about, I recommend that you go visit the show notes for today’s episode. They can be found at teachinginhighered.com/245. There’s also an option to sign up for a weekly e-mail that will send those to you over e-mail along with an article I write about teaching or productivity each week. And so you can subscribe at teachinginhighered.com/subscribe. There’s also a forum throughout much of the web. So thanks so much for listening. See you next time.

Teaching in Higher Ed transcripts are created using a combination of an automated transcription service and human beings. This text likely will not represent the precise, word-for-word conversation that was had. The accuracy of the transcripts will vary. The authoritative record of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcasts is contained in the audio file.