Bonni Stachowiak [00:00:00]:

Today Bonni episode number 485 of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast, how to use questions in new ways in our teaching with Pia Lauritzen. Welcome to this episode of teaching in higher ed. I’m Bonni Stachowiak, and this is the space where we explore the art and science of being more effective at facilitating learning. We also share ways to improve our productivity approaches so we can have more peace in our lives, and be even more present for our students. I’m so thrilled to have joining me today, Pia Lauritzen. She’s a Danish philosopher and tech entrepreneur. She holds a PhD in philosophy and is the inventor and founder of Quest and Question Jam. She’s published 5 books. Questions is upcoming on John Hopkins University Press in November of 2023 and her regular column for strategy and business is read by more than 20,000 decision makers worldwide. Her 2019 TEDx Talk is titled What you don’t know about questions. And in August 2023, she was shortlisted for the Thinker’s 50 radar award for providing powerful proof that questions rather than generic answers will shape our futures. Pia Lauritzen. Welcome to Teaching in Higher Ed.

Pia Lauritzen [00:01:40]:

Thank you so much, Bonni.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:01:42]:

I invite you to start our conversation by introducing us to your mother-in-law, but not your mother-in-law of today, but let’s pick Your mother-in-law of 10 years ago.

Pia Lauritzen [00:01:59]:

Oh, I’m not sure I’d dad go there. No. I have a wonderful mother-in-law, and she’s always been wonderful. And she’s always had this, is always, you know, the people who say, I’m just asking. She’s one of those people. And based on the work I’m doing and my thoughts background and interesting questions. Of course, I’ve been very intrigued by that. What is that? What is it? Why do people say that? Why do they say they’re just asking? When in fact, usually when people are saying that they are not just asking. They are telling you something. They want you to know something. Usually, it’s about something they think you’re missing or something they they think you should be doing that you’re not doing. And that definitely also has been the case with my mother-in-law. So I think I have been curious to find out What why do people say? I’m just asking, and what are we supposed to do with it? And why do we react the way we do when people do ask with that question? Because typically doesn’t bring up the best of us.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:03:02]:

Yeah. So many times I interpret those things as well, no. You’re not actually really asking a question, what I interpret it as is it can sometimes feel like a critique and Most of us have sat in some kind of an academic conference before. It’s like there’s this this trope or this stereotype, but because it’s real and it happens. So frequently, if somebody raising their hand and say, I have a question. Actually, it’s more of a comment, you know, and and that, I mean, and that can be so vulnerable for anyone to stand up at an academic conference and a lot of our disciplines, a lot of our contacts are ready, people ready to pounce or can feel like ready to pounce on what’s missing, what what got wrong. And so it doesn’t feel like a question. It feels like a a critique, a a a control. There’s there’s some power and some control. And I also, by the way, before we I wanna be self aware enough to know. That doesn’t mean that’s always what’s happening. I mean, some sometimes that can be within us, a feeling of insecurity Giorgia a feeling of I don’t wish to be controlled. I, you know, some kind of a dynamic that really lives within us that has nothing to do with that other person.

Pia Lauritzen [00:04:17]:

Yeah. And there is certain something going on with uncertainty when it comes to questions. And and I also, notice that you you use the word power I think we all know from a very basic place, we know that questions are extremely powerful. And that means that if we actually do raise the question, if we actually do want to ask someone a question that is critical, that has some some message that maybe we’re not ready to to present that message as in I have something I want you to know. This is important, then we can say, well, I have a question, or I’m just asking, or I have a comment It’s kind of to, you know, weaken the power of the question a little bit. But but we are wiser than that. We know what’s going Bonni. When people say I’m just asking, we know, uh-oh, now you’re imposing something on me, and I didn’t ask you to do that. I didn’t even invite you to do that. So so please don’t. So I think there’s so much going on, beneath the service when it comes to, questions. And we pick that up in all kinds of ways, and then we have all these ways of talking about it. It’s just a very, very, what’s it called, superficial level And there’s so much more to questions than that.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:05:37]:

When I was in my late twenties, it was my first time in my career having a executive level type of a And I remember this man came into the company. He took up a lot of space and he knew it. And, he would tell me. He he would he was constantly asking questions, and he would tell me you watch you watch whoever’s asking questions is the one with the power.

Pia Lauritzen [00:06:01]:

I’m interested.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:06:01]:

And he’s still I still think back to him with some amusement. I I do believe if he were here today, having this conversation with us, He certainly enjoyed the the way that that felt to have that power. I think, I mean, he he clearly got some sort of a energy from that. And I I I think maybe I don’t wanna live my life getting energy over having, you know, wanting to to have that kind of yield that kind of power, but At the same time, there is a way in which the power and influence we might have can be used for good. And I would love to have us now shift our context a little bit to talking about asking questions in a classroom context. What do you see as we get into a classroom, the ways in which our fears our anxieties around questions and asking them or answering them. What what are some things that come up for you in terms of of of how the how this idea of of questions, power, fear comes into that context.

Pia Lauritzen [00:07:08]:

There are things that actually. I I did this study. Now I think it’s about 10 years ago where I did observational studies of, different school classes. A Russian, a Danish, a Chinese, and a Spanish group class to actually to find out, do people use questions differently? In different language communities. Do the teachers use questions differently? Do the students use questions differently? And they certainly did. It was extremely inspiring to see. And what I found was that there is a connection between posing a question and taking a position. And there’s also a connection between giving a response and taking responsibility. So you can hear it in the wording, and that’s not a coincidence you can hear it in very series of different languages. And and what I realized was that we actually use questions to distribute responsibility. And we do that differently in different language communities. So a teacher can use questions to impose responsibility on the students. So let’s say I’m asking a question and now it’s up to the student to prove that they can respond that they have the responsibility of providing an answer. But you could also use questions for the exact opposite. So in the Chinese school class, for instance, I noticed that when the teacher ask a question, they are taking responsibility themselves showing, so now I’m actually, I’m just testing. Do you know the same thing I know? So it’s not to to, impose responsibility and others to take responsibility themselves, and the students become responsive. Someone who are just supposed to to come up with the right answer. That’s a completely different way of using questions. And finally, you could do some, a third thing that could say, okay, when I ask questions, I’m actually not asking questions to take responsibility myself or to impose responsibility on you. I’m doing it to share responsibility. So now we have to have this conversation where we learn something together where I’m being open to the fact that maybe I don’t have all the answers. Maybe you don’t have all the answers. Maybe now it’s the time for us to explore this topic, the subject together. So these 3 different ways of using questions, I found them based on the observational studies in different language cultures, but I also think that all have, you know, in teaching situations that we see aspects of all three of them. And if we are consciously working with this, I believe we can build learning environments that are, you know, better for people to share their uncertainties, to share their doubts, to to actually ask for help when they need it and and ask actually saying, okay, right now, there’s something here. I’m extremely curious about this. But and I can’t move on before I get the answer to this question. So how do we cultivate these environments? Will people feel comfortable and feel safe to ask questions, both from the teacher perspective and from the student perspective. I think that’s probably one of the most important questions for us to ask, especially in these, AI times.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:10:12]:

Did you notice cultural differences or perhaps that the study or studies haven’t measured for this, but 8 differing degrees of comfort levels with questions that do not have, quote, right answers?

Pia Lauritzen [00:10:25]:

No. Actually, I didn’t. I think at least the teachers I was observing, they were they didn’t even go there. You know, they didn’t go there where it was a possibility for the students to to ask these kind of questions. They were brilliant teachers. I could see that. But I think I would, I would think that it would be a different and maybe even a more fruitful learning environment if it would felt more comfortable for the educators to go there, to to establish a a space where people could ask questions that no in the room were able to answer, but but that’s not how the education world was designed to work, I think. But I think things are changing right now, and I think they need to change, you know, with AI and and everything. We we need to have different ways of of embracing questions because, now, answers will not be the most interesting thing because we can we can have technology provide the answers So we need to cultivate our ability to ask insightful questions and an insightful questions more or less per default have no clear answers. So that’s why we have to discuss them. That’s why we have to ask them.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:11:40]:

Yeah. I’m seeing 2 real threads here, one would be with emergence of these large language models and other types of artificial intelligence. It really does change The formula. I mean, it’s intriguing just to think about what a Google search meant when Google first came out. And then how the types of questions are different with something like a large language model. The other theme that I hear you talking a bit about We haven’t explored it much, but but what what we call these wicked problems, I mean, climate change is not going to be changed in a single semester or term, but that’s what we’re accustomed to. You you the educational systems for the most part have been designed for these arbitrary lengths of time. Sadly, sometimes arbitrary measures of what learning might mean in that context and not really leaving a lot of room for questions that do not have answers today. And there’s no right answer. I mean, it’s gonna be they’re they’re they’re far too complex to I’ve ever think that there is going to be an answer to, but we don’t really I I don’t see a lot just getting practiced at the skill of asking questions. And both of those contexts, of course, really need that skill, and it’s not something that I I have, been witnessed to seeing us do very well in educational systems.

Pia Lauritzen [00:12:58]:

No. And and now what I see I see a lot is that people instead of of talking about how do we help each other ask questions and and especially ask But I typically, I would call them the 3 big ease, the existential, the ethic ethical and the epistemological questions, because the 3 big ease other questions that no one, and especially not a machine can answer for us. You know, these are the questions we have to come up with. Each and every one of us, and also, you know, on a societal and a community and a classroom level. You know, we we all need to have these conversations. And and to ask and answer and discuss these questions, we need to to create this space where it’s okay for us to to not know the answer. And and I think that’s what happens right now is that instead of addressing that, people are talking about how to make good prompts. And I’m kinda like, well, you guys, what’s going on right now is that instead of exploring the question that only you can ask and only you can come up with the answers to, you are trying to adjust your questions to the machine. You’re trying to ask the questions in a way that you know the machine can deliver the answers, but that’s not the task right now because we will figure that, along the way. But if we get how to ask the questions, the 3 e questions. If we don’t help each other and remind each other to ask these questions, then we’re letting go of something that’s so much more important and has so much more value than whether the machine will be prompted in this on the other way. So, so I think we need to pay a lot of attention right now, not to, not to confuse things, not to saying, well, but we are learning our Stefanie, we’re teaching our students to prompt better Isn’t that teaching them to ask questions? It’s not. It’s asking that it’s teaching them to prompt. And, and prompting is adjusting to machine. Asking questions, exploring what’s unique, and what’s important for human beings.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:14:58]:

Whenever I hear about those kinds of things, it tends to be it tends to have a flavor of masculinity to me. And it’ll be things like hacks. You know, you’re gonna have 5 hacks to a better prompt or whatever, and it I perceive it as a very transactional way. And these existential epistemological ethical questions, are not transactional. Yeah. And what I’m about to share, I have I have only anecdotal evidence for, but I’m fascinated by this idea because I have asked in a number of different contexts, how people feel about students using AI to complete their assignments for example, and generally speaking, you can imagine that’s not positive in most contexts. But then when I ask Either students or professors. So they’ve already answered the first half of the question, which is how do you feel if students are using this? Generally speaking, that is perceived as a method of cheating or a shortcut or a, you know, you you have to go through the same things I went through. And that that’s the context. Students alike, by the way, students saying this. This is not purely a faculty perception in my anecdotal research. But then on the other side, when I ask very similar questions, how do students or how do faculty feel about faculty who would use artificial intelligence for grading The same qualities are not ascribed or on that. And I think, well, isn’t that kind of the same thing? Isn’t that a cheating in terms of what that could mean. Because these three questions that you spoke about, I I some sometimes really struggle because I’ll I’ll the classes that I teach that those are very relevant in the classes that I teach. But I get sometimes transactional answers, and I think It gets sad because I think you just don’t know there’s someone right here. I will I will get I started asking 2 or two and a half years ago, a supplement to our course evaluation because I couldn’t get what I what I wanted out of it. And I asked a question. Did you perceive that I cared about you this semester? And and if so, or if not, what was one example that made you feel like I cared or made you feel like I didn’t care? So far going strong on a 100% that I cared. I gotta break it at some point because we know perfection is not possible in this case, but so far in all these years I have, But what’s been fascinating to me is that early in the pandemic, the care was translated. My light qualitative analysis was overwhelming. The care was expressed through flexibility.

Pia Lauritzen [00:17:31]:

Mhmm.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:17:32]:

And then more recently, the last year and a half or so, the care has been expressed through that I give feedback. They say, oh, you give feedback on every single assignment. I’m thinking, Pia, I don’t actually think I get a 100%, but I’m close. Right? I mean, and they’re going like, this is markedly different. And I just think this is do you have you ever ran into that? This this thing where what we say if students use a tool that we don’t apply the same thing when some faculty publishing companies, what have you, you know, the the profits are made By automating what should just be the deep exploration of these kinds of questions you just discussed.

Pia Lauritzen [00:18:09]:

But I think it makes a lot of sense. You know, it’s so much easier to to you see maybe you see the the pain, you know, when other people are, are moving themselves away from you because that’s kind of, like, putting in some kind of, AI or some kind of tool putting in between you guys. You don’t like that? Is it, well, people are distancing themselves from you, but you don’t see it the same way when you’re doing it because that’s extremely difficult to see that Right now, I was, yeah, I was the one, doing I was the one moving away, or I was the one taking the easy, way out here. I think that’s extremely difficult to see. And and I also think that there’s something going on with this with this idea that that that we have to the question have questions have always been connected with answers, obviously. We ask the question. We want that answer. But what we tend to forget is that It’s extremely rare that we ask questions to get answers. Typically, we ask questions for all kinds of other since. We just talked about my mother-in-law in the beginning of this, you know, asking a question, obviously, to draw my attention towards Well, maybe we used to be doing some gardening, or maybe you should change with this Charles, you know. So the, asking a question was never about getting an answer. And we do that all the time. When when we ask our our kids to do stuff for us, sometimes we ask it as a question. Would you please take out the trash, or would you, you know, and if they say no, it’s kinda like, well, that what’s not the deal? But why did you ask them? So I think we are blind to a lot of the context where we are asking questions. We think questions have one purpose, but they don’t have several purposes. And if we fail to acknowledge that, then I think that we can be blind to when we are doing it ourself when we are, you know, taking the easy way out in situations where we actually had an opportunity to have an ethical conversation or to reflect on an existential challenge. We we said that we’re just too fast. We’re moving, ahead, and we didn’t realize, oh, maybe that was my chance. And especially when you have kids, it can be in your house, so it can be in a bus or young people. I think it’s the most valuable thing we have. It’s when, you know, the attention and did you feel like care is the most valuable thing we can do for each other, but it’s to simply just look at people in the eye to simply just take a moment every time. Was that my clue? It’s now my chance to have that conversation that that will make my day, but, and hopefully, also make sense for the people, for the person I’m talking to, we need to pay more attention to that. And the trickiest thing is, and I think this is something that most people don’t know, but we cannot teach each other to ask questions. We cannot learn from others how to pay attention and how to be ethical, creatures, we have to do it ourselves. And that’s just, you know, it’s so easy to say, well, I have a curriculum I have something I need to teach. I need these students need to be able to know this and this and this, and they need to take an exam and stuff like that. And the stuff we we cannot teach, how do we deal with that? And and that’s the most important thing because if we’re not cultivating people’s curiosity, if we’re not cultivating the creative creativity and their critical thinking, then they won’t learn anything. Anyway, so so we we we need to pay more attention to this class. And democratize them. So we make sure that everybody feels inclined to ask questions as how often as possible. And not only the big guy you were talking about, when you obviously knew how to do it.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:21:55]:

Earlier you were speaking about that fear that can come from not knowing the answer to a question. And I’d like to take us back to a classroom context now that where that fear lives lives on to see another day. The other fear that gets coupled with is that fear of silence. So the combination of the fear of not knowing combined With a fear of silence, any advice for people to relieve a little bit? What’s the release valve for those 2 types of fears? Or is it different techniques or is it lumped into the same of not knowing the answer and also that terror that some people can experience of that silence in that room or that that zoom.

Pia Lauritzen [00:22:39]:

But I think it is the same. I think it’s the extension anxiety, you know, like, kierkegaard and Heidegger and some of these old guys talking about, you know, it’s guy, like, we’re born into this world without having all the answers. That’s why we kind of start up by asking a lot of whys and asking, after that, asking a lot of whals and what, and we, we don’t have the answers. And, and that’s not it is really not very comforting. It’s, it’s, it feels terrible. Unless we kind of, you know, make the decisions and say, well, that’s the fact. That’s what being human is all about. That’s what makes it possible for us to learn and grow. That’s actually because we don’t have all the answers in advance. If we did, we would not be these curious, explore the creatures, and we would not grow and learn. So so it takes a lot of practice, I think. For some people, you know, from very from the very beginning being children, they realized, okay, the question team is a good team. You know, that’s a fun team. That where we are, you know, evolving a lot, and that’s where everything can happen. The curiosity and the creativity team. And then at some point, we realize that curiosity comes without and creativity comes with uncertainty. And so we realize that it’s a big family, the family of questions, It’s not just the fun cousins. It’s also all the scary ones. And for us to really, you know, explore and unfold our creative and and curious potential, we have to be okay with the dark sites too. So I think it’s a question that of of a practice and and realizing I if I want the fun part, I I need to find a way to deal with the with a tough one as well.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:24:22]:

As we hear your stories and we we think about the challenges that come with asking questions, I’m so pleased to report to listeners that we we we actually have a practical way to not just practice because as you said, I mean, these these are things that we have to learn ourselves and maybe maybe it’s just a lifelong quest. And so sometimes we can rely on structure that is external from ourselves, that maybe we don’t have to wait until we catch up with getting better at this stuff. Would you tell us a bit about question jam?

Pia Lauritzen [00:24:56]:

Yes. I would love to do that. So at some point, my, my colleague, Marie and I, we realize that if it’s not about teaching her to ask questions, but we really believe that questions is extremely powerful, and it’s the one superpower that can leverage learning and really make sure that that that people are being curious together Then what can we do? You know, we cannot teach it, but what can we do? And and we strongly believe that if we just trust let people know how to ask questions because they do all my research show that that everybody knows how to ask questions. Then we can built technology that can help them remember that this is something they enjoy doing. This is something that’s not dangerous. This is something they can do together. So question game is a very simple tool. It’s designed around the idea that we can have people in the classroom ask and answer each other’s questions about a specific topic. So instead of having the teacher doing, a quiz, a Kahoot, or something like that, what’s the teacher deciding what should be asked, and then all the the students have turned into respondents as we talked about earlier. Then saying, no, let’s democratize the power of questions. Let’s everyone ask their own questions and pick one of their peers to answer the question. So for 7 minutes, it’s a 7 minute game. All the students exchange questions and answers one on one on that digital platform, where they exchange questions about the topic set by the teacher. And after that, the game ends, maybe each student would typically ask 3 to 5 questions and answer 3 to 5 questions themselves as well. At the end, the teacher will get a word cloud showing the words that people were using in the cache. Click this work plot to see what were the questions and answers and use this collective curiosity to move the discussion forward, to facilitate, a different dialogue on the topic, that has been has been taught in the in the classroom. So this is a way of saying, you don’t have to be afraid of not knowing the answers because now what we’re doing is that we are using this simple game where the whole idea is we don’t have the answers. And we should help each other find the answers. And it’s not like the teachers, the, almighty, all, knowing a god that will give all the answers. No. This is something we we’re supposed to learn together. So that’s kind of the idea.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:27:26]:

I’ve I’ve had an opportunity to use it a few times. And in each instance, the questions that were posed me as an individual. And then if you want to, you don’t have to do this, but if you want to, you could include your email and then it emails you the list of all the questions that were asked. And so as I think back on those few occasions, I would say it’s close to a 100% of the questions that were asked were not the type of questions that have right or wrong answers. There are people who are sharing not a lack of knowledge. They’re more sharing challenges, which don’t have simple answers. Do do you find as as you’ve done your research that this type of a structure would lend itself more toward questions that don’t have right or wrong answers, or is it simply because the group of people I happen to be with for those endeavors?

Pia Lauritzen [00:28:16]:

No. It’s definitely the case. And and it’s based, you know, it’s not being a crisp structure. It’s being the opposite. So the quiz is about, do I get the right answer? Do I get the wrong answer? Whereas this, when you when it’s designed to cultivate that it could cultivate curiosity, then it becomes a given that people will ask questions that that makes them curious. Something is not about it would be extremely, boring, I think, to participate in a question, James, where it’s about testing. Do you also know this? Now now I you have the opportunity of asking a question where I can learn something from this other person that can help me move forward not asking it to get an answer. I’m asking it to maybe ask a new question to maybe learn something that would make me change my direction a little bit or just take a step forward. So I think that is part of the structure. And I think one is the technology, but the methodology behind the technology can be used also in all kinds of setting. So if you really believe that asking questions is something that cultivate this curiosity and and creative thinking, then you should make sure to create these spaces in all kinds of situations, not only by using the tool, but also, you know, now we’re going for a walker talk or now we’re going, you know, we’re doing stuff differently. To cultivate and make it comfortable for people to ask these questions.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:29:43]:

What advice would you have for people to become more comfortable with this shift from the responsibility is on me as the professor to have all the answers to perhaps living in a space where I might be able to be in a place where I don’t have all the answers.

Pia Lauritzen [00:30:03]:

I I think we need to be really nice to ourselves. You know, I think we need to be really patient with ourselves. And and I love baby steps. I I think sometimes we put too much pressure on our questions, and therefore, we also tend to put pressure on other people’s questions. So I think it’s important that we don’t think of questions as something that has to be right or something or good questions, we need to ask. There’s a lot going on about asking good questions or better questions or asking the right questions to get the right answers And I think that’s too much pressure to put on the questions and thereby to ourselves. So I think by practicing, you know, thinking of questions as a small entities that that wants to do something that’s important and make room for them, whether they come from ourselves or come from others, saying, well, this is not a judgment. This is this is the exact opposite. This is what we do when we search when we’re about to find out. Where to go. So we should not stop each other at that stage. Yeah. And we should not stop ourselves at that stage. We should be, oh, maybe there’s something here that I didn’t know. Maybe this is a gift, and and and that’s, yeah, I don’t know if that is of any help, but I really think we should be nice to ourselves.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:31:19]:

Oh, I love that. I love that so much. Just we can be so hard on ourselves. And then and then we take that hardness and we projected on other people. And there’s actually quite a bit of gentleness sometimes in our students that we miss If we’re taking our hardness on ourselves and we’re protecting that as if that’s coming from them.

Pia Lauritzen [00:31:39]:

I think that’s right.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:31:41]:

Yeah. This is the time in the show where we each get to share our recommendations. And I have 2. I’ve talked about that I started recording my welcome videos for classes in a little bit of a different format. The first time I shared a, I don’t know, maybe 6 months ago about recording a video where I was holding my phone So and and it was it was recording a video of me walking around my neighborhood. So they don’t see my face. But then on in in most video editors, you could place on top of video and image. So I might put an image of a picture of our family or I might put an image of me you know, hugging a student at graduation. And it is not often that in today’s TikTok generation, I might get compliments. Not that I that’s what I’m seeking for. What I’m seeking with the welcome video is truly a sense of welcome. And part of that is approachability that I would be a person that you could could come and be in community with. So it’s, but I just found it fascinating that I did not set out to, like, intrigue the TikTok generation with my amazing video footage My friend teased me because I had said to her, I just didn’t feel like putting my makeup on that day. And she’s like, how much time does it take you to put your makeup on compared to learning this? But I what I love about when you learn something new, then the next time it doesn’t take that long. So this time, I was recording a welcome video for a different class. And so I I just did a different we were at a park. I was at a park with the kids and and my husband. And so I I just this particular park had a circular, like, a quarter mile circular track, and I basically walked around that. But at some points in time, I panned the camera toward him and toward the kids and then panned it back to the route that I was taking. And so People have if you’ve listened to this podcast for a while, you’ve not just heard me mention this, but you’ve heard other people mention this to the Pia, and and it goes back to so much of what Pia has been sharing. The question of asking people, what do you notice? What do you wonder? So I was able to share this welcome video. It’s only, like, 3 minutes long. And and I asked the students, I want you to look at what you notice, what you wonder, not just the pictures that I place, on the screen in the video, I want you to notice what’s happening in the background. And it reminded me a little bit way back when Kathy Kathy David’s was Bonni. She was talking about those studies on attention with the basketball where you’re supposed to count. How many baskets does the person wearing the white shirt make how many baskets does this person with a black shirt make? And then there’s a gorilla that walk a person in a gorilla costume that walks by. If you’re like me, you don’t notice the gorilla because you’re so focused or whatever that is. It reminded me a little bit of that. It was a fun way There there was nothing magic happening in the background, but it was just a fun way to get them curious. All they were doing was playing bass ball. And somebody noticed, like, somebody made a joke about Mike Trout, which is a famous baseball player in our local region who our daughter happens to love. She even has the jersey with his number and his name on it. So I thought, like, that there wasn’t there was no, like, test. Was there a right answer for what they saw in the background? But it was just fascinating to me what they chose to attend to. Some people said, oh, I noticed that they were they were playing multiple sports. And I told my husband later, you weren’t playing multiple sports. He goes, well, we kinda were. There was a kick ball. And there was a a softball. And we were so it’s just, like, fascinating to me. Again, that there weren’t right and wrong answer. So I just, I guess, I have a two pieces of advice. 1 would just be exploring and playing with video format. I’m finding this really a fun medium to have They they see it tends to get them curious. If I’m taking them on a walk, that seems to be something that sparks curiosity and then placing the images. It’s a fun thing to play with And then the second recommendation I have is that Derek Breff, when he was on very recently, he recommended 3 episodes of a podcast called Planet Bonni. And the 3 episodes are both them showing behind the scenes and then the final product of them developing an episode entirely with the use of artificial intelligence. And if you happen to listen to that episode with Derek Breuf, you will hear me audibly gasp as he shares this and tell him that the second I left my house that day to go for the drive I was planning, I was gonna be listening. Talk about curiosity it’s fascinating. And they’re very entertaining, by the way. They if you’ve never listened to Planet Money, they’re just so entertaining. But it is fascinating to listen to them. Behind the scenes, talk about what needed to happen for them to produce the audio, to produce the script, to do the interviews, to ask the crime. I mean, it it it is an absolute hoot, but I just founded a fascinating journey just looking at what artificial intelligence is capable of what it’s not. And and just I I cannot recommend it enough. Derek Breff was not wrong. And in case you missed that episode, I’m here to tell you, do not miss these 3 Planet Money episodes about artificial intelligence. And now I’m Bonni pass it over to Pia for whatever she would like to recommend.

Pia Lauritzen [00:36:48]:

This sounds so exciting. I would I think maybe there is a bit of a similarities I would recommend writing a question log. I really have, I have always, you know, a notebook with me. And the idea of paying attention to what are the questions other people are asking? What are the questions I’m asking myself? So simply write them down because we don’t pay an off a pension to when and how and why we use questions. And by writing them down and having, you know, this question log, we realize interesting things about, the questions we miss because if we don’t pay attention and if we don’t give ourselves the task of writing down the questions, There is a risk that we don’t hear every time someone asks us a question. So we maybe we think, well, our students never ask any question, but maybe by paying attention, we will realize that, actually, they are sometimes asking us questions, but we don’t necessarily address them. I realized that when I did the test with my own family, one morning, I realized, oh my god. My kids are asking me all these questions. And I’m not responding properly. I’m just I’m Bonni, right? Move moving on. But sometimes we also realize by doing a question log, that people are asking each other questions that we’re not paying attention to. And if we pick up on some of the questions that one student is asking another Stefanie, or, you know, a student is asking another professor. Then we will be more attentive to what is it that piques people’s curiosity. And I think that’s what it’s all about. So that will be my recommendation.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:38:26]:

Oh, thank you so much. And do you recommend categorizing them in any way or just Just log them. Just log them.

Pia Lauritzen [00:38:32]:

I can’t help but categorizing them because that’s I’m curious about how many of these questions were why questions, how many were, how, and were they focused on social relationships where they focused on at a specific topic. So I get curious when I see other people’s questions, and that’s what leads to some kind of categorization. I think people should do whatever makes sense for them. I’m sure something will come out you know, when you when you find yourself looking at other people’s questions as data, and that’s what I do with question Jam as Lauritzen? And and with another digital platform called Quest that has the same, but it has a more analytical, feature to it than, land question jam. Then it’s all about finding these patterns. What happens when you look at other people’s questions is that you become curious. You you start asking questions yourself, and that’s a good thing.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:39:21]:

I love that so much. We had given some prizes out for our faculty gathering recently. And a colleague of mine had bought me this book. It’s almost like a combination of an art book combined with a journal. It’s it’s a really beautiful book, but I had told one of my friend when the when the prize and I had told her This is a book that I’ve never written and it’s designed to be a journal, but I’ve just kept it pristine, you know, sitting there. It’s more like I’m just intrigued by this book. But she said one of her colleagues had come in, and it just happened that the page that they opened to was a journal. Instead of keeping track of questions, Pia, it was keeping track of curse words, like which curse words that you say throughout its time period. And I found it fascinating they had 3 or 4 categorizations for curse words. And I think because I I’ve talked about before on the show. It’s been a long time, but I still remember this conversation. So I treasured this so much, but the idea of we’re trying not to teach our children, there are bad words, and there are good words. I try to teach them that there are imprecise words. A lot of the problems that I think us adults have with children using curse words or teenagers or whatever is that they’re just not very precise. Kind of, we can do better with our vocabulary. And then sometimes they are used in a a less appropriate context. So I’m trying not to put place a label of it. It’s a bad word, as opposed to a a good word But anyway, I was just intrigued by this idea of of sorting, our our instances, of course, words, because, of course, another really big thing that the page, would seem to indicate to me is when we are cursing at someone and and applying our curse words to them and their humanity. Of course, that can be the most egregious use of curse words versus if we stub our toe and you know, decide to — Yeah. — drop 1 on a word.

Pia Lauritzen [00:41:03]:

Yeah. When when you mentioned that, I think, you know, if there was some characterization, I think, would actually be useful for when collecting questions and tracking questions would be, and I use that with with working with companies Bonni with question data. Is to to look at the questions and say, okay, how many of these questions am I supposed to know the answer to? How many of these questions should be discussed collectively. This is something people should have a conversation about, and how many of these questions is not supposed to have an answer yet. Because if you have that systematic approach, then I think it becomes easier to deal with these questions that nobody Bonni supposed to have the answer to. So that could be a way of doing it, tracking some questions, logging, you know, what are the questions we’re asking, and then making it as an official structure for how to talk about questions. That could be a way to take some of the pressure of, these, uninturable questions.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:41:58]:

And if anyone partakes in this activity, I know that I would and I know Pia would love to hear from you. So write in, let us know how it goes for you. And if you decided to categorize, it doesn’t matter. We would really be intrigued. We’re curious about if you decide to participate. Please please write us because we we would really, really love to hear from you. So It’s been such a joy getting to know you. I got to be with you on the my Qvest session that you led. I I walked away from that so energized and full of curiosity and and really enjoyment in using question jam. So thank you for that. And it’s just been a joy to get to know you, through your other work and having this conversation with you today.

Pia Lauritzen [00:42:34]:

You too. Really a pleasure to be here.

Bonni Stachowiak [00:42:39]:

Thanks once again Lupi Pia Lauritzen for joining me on today’s episode of Teaching in Higher Ed. Today’s episode was produced by me, Bonni Stachowiak. It was edited by the ever talented Andrew Kroeger. Podcast production support was provided by the amazing Sierra Smith. Thanks to each one of you for listening. And if you’ve yet to sign up for the weekly update from Teaching in Higher Ed, head over to teachinginhighered.com/subscribe, you’ll get the most recent episode’s show notes, along with some other resources that don’t show up in those show notes. Over to teachinginhighered.com/subscribe, and I’ll see you next time on teaching in higher ed.

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